Do not make DayZ SA Moddable.

[sachad 1016]

Comparing the mod to the standalone is comparing a moped to a sports bike. The standalone exists precisely to take the premise of the mod and turn it into a completely unique game that isn't bound by the limitations of being a mod. The fact that they're two different experiences is kind of the whole selling point.

 

Also, you complain that people want to turn the SA into Epoch, so then why are you opposed to mods? Epoch-style mods would shut these people up and stop them from tying to push their own demands onto the SA. Like it or not, there will always be many players who will turn DayZ into a PvP deathmatch game, so then why would you oppose anything that would help separate these people from the rest of the player base? There's going to be mods that do precisely the opposite of Epoch, too. 

 

The only reason people stop playing stuff is because they're bored with it or have a better alternative. If the vanilla mod servers are empty, that speaks more about the vanilla mod than it does about the mods that took all its players away. 

 

Incidentally, you already bought the singleplayer version of this game.

[grimlok 77]

Comparing the mod to the standalone is comparing a moped to a sports bike. The standalone exists precisely to take the premise of the mod and turn it into a completely unique game that isn't bound by the limitations of being a mod. The fact that they're two different experiences is kind of the whole selling point.

 

Also, you complain that people want to turn the SA into Epoch, so then why are you opposed to mods? Epoch-style mods would shut these people up and stop them from tying to push their own demands onto the SA. Like it or not, there will always be many players who will turn DayZ into a PvP deathmatch game, so then why would you oppose anything that would help separate these people from the rest of the player base? There's going to be mods that do precisely the opposite of Epoch, too. 

 

The only reason people stop playing stuff is because they're bored with it or have a better alternative. If the vanilla mod servers are empty, that speaks more about the vanilla mod than it does about the mods that took all its players away. 

 

Incidentally, you already bought the singleplayer version of this game.

Again, do not compare something that you've never played.  Just stop.

 

I'm not opposed to DayZ being a PvP deathmatch.  I'm opposed to DayZ being a PvP death match where everyone has a sky base, with helicopters and cars/trucks coming out of their yin yang.

 

People stopped playing the vanilla mod because of hackers, you'd know this if you had actually played so again, stop comparing something you've never played.

 

And I bought a single player game?  Really now?  I've never had to connect to a server to play a single player game before.  Can you please show me how to play the game offline and in single player?

[FlimFlamm 509]

Do not compare something that you've never played.  Just stop...

 

 

Just because Sacha has never played the mod doesn't means their comparisons aren't accurate and your own aren't terrible. I've played thousands upon thousands of hours on the mod and I can happily tell you that she is in fact correct. People stopped playing vanilla because it got boring. People came back to DayZ when mods released additional content to keep the game interesting.

 

On the idea that the SA is going to be the same as the mod, I wrote some pretty specific stuff, here it is  just for you:

 

The insidious lie that a modded SA will be exactly the same as the DayZ mod is so jampacked with falsehood that it literally fatigues me to read it; my mind recoils at the ignorance of this idea. First of all, the "DayZ mod" by definition was not one exact thing, it was a cornucopia of different mods servers and players. There is not one ultimate way to define the DayZ mod, whether it be "too militarized" or "too buggy" because the DayZ mod was a collection of many things, some of which were drastically different from one another. In the DayZ mod you had choice. You could choose what mod to play and what server to play on, and if the mod and server were any good, chances are you would have a good time. The diversity of the DayZ mods are literally what gave longevity to the game. The irony about the understanding of some people in this thread regarding this phenomenon is that the vanilla servers would have dried up either way. At least with the mods they kept playing DayZ instead of abandoning the game entirely.

Edited July 13, 2015 by FlimFlamm

[OrLoK 16182]

Hello there

 

If they are allowed i am 100pc sure there will be many 1100000cars all weapons!!!1! servers.

 

And if the majority of players want that, then fine.

 

For those of us who want a vanilla experience then there *will* be those also.

 

id rather play with a smaller more dedicated community than those with the leet lewt mentality.

 

DAYZ mods will not be "bad" for the game.

 

Its all about the filters.

 

Rgds

 

LoK

[FlimFlamm 509]

For those of us who want a vanilla experience then there *will* be those also.

 

According to some in this thread, modding means that everyone will play on skybase vehicle bonanza servers with VTOL jets and APCs. They say that there are going to be zero players on anything other than "sky commander and the world of tomorrow" servers. (which incidentally means that they themselves have abandoned their own values and have simply followed the mainsteam :) !)

 

I really tried my best to squash the foolishness of this thread, but people are really hopped up on their idea that the modding community is going to completely usurp what in their mind is some divine and immaculate vanilla experience. (that they have not yet even seen, and have no clue what the final version would look like, nor the mods).

 

These people (you all know who you are :) ) need to understand the fact that vanilla servers will always exist. DayZ SA vanilla is going to be one hundred times better than the original vanilla, so people aren't going to need to rely on mods for content. If the only remaining argument is that vanilla servers will dry up then not only is it naive but it's juvenile and greedy. Other people bought the game too, with the understanding that there would be modding, and complaining that not everyone will be playing what someone wants them to play is blatantly self-centered.

Edited July 13, 2015 by FlimFlamm

[OrLoK 16182]

Hello there

 

@everyone dont forget that modding can also go the other way.

 

Ie creating an even more realistic hardcore experience or changing the zeds from "runners" to "Romero's"

 

The possibilities are endless.

 

Rgds

 

LoK

[agouti 105]

Modding will be the only thing that saves this game, as its the only thing that saves every game. Dayz is just unique in that it's open to script kiddies, and a better part of the community seems unable to distinguish between a mod and a script kiddie. I remember battlefield 1942 and the only thing that kept that game alive was the awesome mods. Then the same with battlefield vietnam and battlefield 2. Then battlefield 3 and 4 ruined it, and everybody hates them.

 

Mods allowed the original 1942 to play as:

Forgotten Hope (a realism mod, but it tried to clumsily balance it and failed spectacularly imo)

XWW2 (a more realistic realism mod)

Vietnam

Desert Combat

Interstate '82

 

Everyone that hates mods is ultimately a consoler -they hate freedom.

 

I remember Namalask and that crazy blood sucker from STALKER (which also required a ton of mods to add the guns necessary to flesh it out).

[roguetrooper 201]

When there will be modding, there will be x different game versions out there and x+1 of them will be incompatible to each other (and to your client). Concerning a standard gameplay and server choice, it will be the same mess as with Arma 1-3. Modding then will not be done because it is good, advantageous or necessary, but only because it is possible. Then you can forget about opening the browser, clicking on a server with a good ping and you are ready to play. It will be a mess and a pain.

[FlimFlamm 509]

When there will be modding, there will be x different game versions out there and x+1 of them will be incompatible to each other (and to your client). Concerning a standard gameplay and server choice, it will be the same mess as with Arma 1-3. Modding then will not be done because it is good, advantageous or necessary, but only because it is possible. Then you can forget about opening the browser, clicking on a server with a good ping and you are ready to play. It will be a mess and a pain.

 

Actually if you had bothered to read about the details of planned mod support you would know that modders will be able to release their modded content directly through steam. Additionally, a robust modding community will emerge around DayZ mods and many different mods will be accumulated together into mod packs that will rise and fall in popularity depending on quality. It will literally be a click and play scenario where you click on the mod or server you want to play and if you don't have them the game files will be downloaded onto your local machine. Then it is actuallly a matter of click and play. The game engine is being designed with modularity and modding in mind so that modders will be able to implement diverse content with a great deal of ease and compatibility compared to many other games. Literally everything you have suggested is far from the likely truth.

 

There will still be vanilla servers. If you want to just load up a random server and get into it and enjoy yourself then there will always be vanilla servers that cater to you. If you want to be a more dedicated player on a specific server, then a brief "waiting for resources to download" screen upon initial entry is insignificant.

Edited July 17, 2015 by FlimFlamm

[grimlok 77]

There will still be vanilla servers. 

Why would someone want to play on empty servers?

Edited July 17, 2015 by leader.one

[therandomredstone 431]

If you don't have certain mods downloaded, you shouldn't have to worry about them.

 

If you don't play on modded servers you shouldn't have to worry about them.

 

Don't want to play with mods? Then don't. and stop worrying about them.

[FlimFlamm 509]

Why would someone want to play on empty servers?

 

"The idea that vanilla servers will be empty is a self defeating argument; a genuine ouroboros. If all the vanilla servers are empty that simply means that the mods have surpassed vanilla in terms of enjoyability, and you will  all be playing the mods too, looking back on this thread as a regretful blip of ignorance. To repeat, if mods become more popular than vanilla, then that means that the entire argument of this thread, that modding should be disallowed or is of negative or no benefit, will have been wrong. Furthermore, the desire to prevent other people form playing what they want on their own servers is unfair and greedy. People who do not want to play the game the way you imagine it aren't going to play your imagined "vanilla" for very long are they?"

[grimlok 77]

"The idea that vanilla servers will be empty is a self defeating argument; a genuine ouroboros. If all the vanilla servers are empty that simply means that the mods have surpassed vanilla in terms of enjoyability, and you will  all be playing the mods too, looking back on this thread as a regretful blip of ignorance. To repeat, if mods become more popular than vanilla, then that means that the entire argument of this thread, that modding should be disallowed or is of negative or no benefit, will have been wrong. Furthermore, the desire to prevent other people form playing what they want on their own servers is unfair and greedy. People who do not want to play the game the way you imagine it aren't going to play your imagined "vanilla" for very long are they?"

Wrong, if vanilla servers are empty that means the developers failed to create a good game and the modders just pandered to those who want to play an easy experience.

[sachad 1016]

Wrong, if vanilla servers are empty that means the developers failed to create a good game and the modders just pandered to those who want to play an easy experience.

 

Explain how liking something over something else automatically makes the something else bad.

 

I liked Rome: Total War. But I liked Rome: Total Realism even better. Does that mean R:TW was a bad game? Fuck no.

[grimlok 77]

Explain how liking something over something else automatically makes the something else bad.

 

I liked Rome: Total War. But I liked Rome: Total Realism even better. Does that mean R:TW was a bad game? Fuck no.

Where did I say bad? 

[sachad 1016]

Where did I say bad? 

You said 'failed to make a good game'. That's bad.

[grimlok 77]

if vanilla servers are empty that means the developers failed to create a good game 

 

 

You said 'failed to make a good game'. That's bad.

Edited July 17, 2015 by leader.one

[FlimFlamm 509]

Wrong, if vanilla servers are empty that means the developers failed to create a good game and the modders just pandered to those who want to play an easy experience.

 

Your argument here is quite weak. An ouroboros, a self defeating argument; a snake that devours itself from the tail.

 

If everyone is playing on the mods rather than vanilla servers then we can conclude that mods are better than vanilla, but this does not necessarily mean that the vanilla game itself is bad, just that the mods are even better.

 

Furthermore you failed to address the main point and genuine issue with your objection, which is that there will always be vanilla servers regardless of how good or bad the mods become. However your assertion that vanilla will be abandoned leads to conclusions which contradict your own premise (that mods aren't in fact a good thing) when in the unlikely scenario where vanilla is in fact abandoned, it's because the mods are better, hence we ought to have them.

Edited July 17, 2015 by FlimFlamm

[BeefBacon 1185]

Mods could very easily go either way. On one hand we'll see AS50s and APCs. On the other we'll see some really cool survival-focused mods (I've mentioned STALKER-themed mods in some other post) and they'd be incredible. There are a lot of things that vanilla will simply never offer. Radiation zones, for example. That's something that I know is popular, but it has no real place in vanilla. Trade posts is another one - granted I'm not sold on trading and currency and such. To deny DayZ mods is to deny DayZ longevity. There will be a time when the Devs are no longer adding to DayZ and without mods it will eventually fade into a tiny community of elitists who were afraid they'd lose the core experience.

 

There will likely always be official vanilla servers. Chernarus is great, but I want the freedom to be eaten by mutants in the Zone.

[sachad 1016]

 

 

 

We're arguing semantics now, is that it?

[Syphonz 64]

*grabs popcorn and watches show*

 

 

 

But really, mods shouldn't be allowed?

 

 

*facepalm so hard*

 

Flim is doing a PHENOMENAL job at laying down the positive argument here, so I'll let him take the reigns. I'll step in if necessary. 

[grimlok 77]

Mods will be good if 

 

a} they are moderated

b} do no detract from the main focal point of the game

c} spawn rate cannot be adjusted

d} cannot give starting gear

e} cannot change how many items/weapons/gear spawn in to the word

[Ironhuge 69]

Mods are fun from time to time, but as with the original dayz mod it only made the player base scattered. My team had a lot of fun with the original mod until branches started to emerge, when some of us preferred vanilla, others turned to Epoch, one completely went lone wolf in Origins. All this resulted in all of us going back to games where everyone had to play the same game, no DayZ at all.

 

I want the good old days back when everyone played the same branch, and servers where populated. With mods you get half decent servers only half populated because there are too many options.

 

That being said, I hope modding comes to DayZ SA, but only after a couple of years have passed so that the main game gets it's attention it needs. If modding is out a couple of months after the game release, I'm afraid that SA will go down the drain almost instantly and cannot recover from the current loss of players.

[FlimFlamm 509]

Mods will be good if 

 

a} they are moderated

b} do no detract from the main focal point of the game

c} spawn rate cannot be adjusted

d} cannot give starting gear

e} cannot change how many items/weapons/gear spawn in to the word

 

a) What does it mean to moderate a mod? Racist, prejudice, or secually explicit content will be disallowed in the steam workshop, I'm sure of it.

 

b) What is your version of "the main focal point of the game" and why do you believe mods will threaten that? Are you aware that for different people, different aspects of the game make it attractive?

 

c) Spawn rates for various items will be able to be turned on and off, raised and decreased, and this won't be an issue. Moded servers will mostly be private hives; the public hive will be fine. And if you want a server with default spawn rates, there will be plenty of them. How does adjustable spawn rates in mods ruin DayZ?

 

d) Starting gear on public hive will always be the same. Starting gear on private hives and mods is completely up to the server hosters; there is no issue here.

 

e) public hive economy will always be standard, private hives will have the option to customize everything. How is this an issue?

 

Mods are fun from time to time, but as with the original dayz mod it only made the player base scattered. My team had a lot of fun with the original mod until branches started to emerge, when some of us preferred vanilla, others turned to Epoch, one completely went lone wolf in Origins. All this resulted in all of us going back to games where everyone had to play the same game, no DayZ at all.

 

I want the good old days back when everyone played the same branch, and servers where populated. With mods you get half decent servers only half populated because there are too many options.

 

That being said, I hope modding comes to DayZ SA, but only after a couple of years have passed so that the main game gets it's attention it needs. If modding is out a couple of months after the game release, I'm afraid that SA will go down the drain almost instantly and cannot recover from the current loss of players.

 

You have to realize that the "good old days" were back when the game was buggy and basic and utter crap compared to what it is now. It's just that the concept and gameplay of DayZ were so revolutionary back then that we all instantly fell in love with it. By the time the mods started getting released, the novelty of DayZ had already subsided and people were looking for newer and better games, games with similar but more features and less bugs. The mods were really the onyl thing that gave the game longevity.

 

I'm sorry that your group couldn't decide on which mod to play on as a group, but it was either that or everyone stops playing DayZ alltogether because we run out of content; there are only so many times you can kill players before you ask yourself what the point is.

[grimlok 77]

a) What does it mean to moderate a mod? Racist, prejudice, or secually explicit content will be disallowed in the steam workshop, I'm sure of it.

 

B) What is your version of "the main focal point of the game" and why do you believe mods will threaten that? Are you aware that for different people, different aspects of the game make it attractive?

 

c) Spawn rates for various items will be able to be turned on and off, raised and decreased, and this won't be an issue. Moded servers will mostly be private hives; the public hive will be fine. And if you want a server with default spawn rates, there will be plenty of them. How does adjustable spawn rates in mods ruin DayZ?

 

d) Starting gear on public hive will always be the same. Starting gear on private hives and mods is completely up to the server hosters; there is no issue here.

 

e) public hive economy will always be standard, private hives will have the option to customize everything. How is this an issue?

 

 

You have to realize that the "good old days" were back when the game was buggy and basic and utter crap compared to what it is now. It's just that the concept and gameplay of DayZ were so revolutionary back then that we all instantly fell in love with it. By the time the mods started getting released, the novelty of DayZ had already subsided and people were looking for newer and better games, games with similar but more features and less bugs. The mods were really the onyl thing that gave the game longevity.

 

I'm sorry that your group couldn't decide on which mod to play on as a group, but it was either that or everyone stops playing DayZ alltogether because we run out of content; there are only so many times you can kill players before you ask yourself what the point is.

If you don't know what the main focal point of the game is, this conversation is done and you're just a troll.  And the focal point follows b, c, d & e

Edited July 20, 2015 by leader.one