Weapons - Where Should They Go Next?

[gibonez 3633]

I want an m16 in any form, I don't like how short/compact the m4 is, I think the m16 is much sexier.  I'd be perfectly fine with limited attachments for it.

 

I think some pretty basic battle rifles that don't support a lot of attachments would also be nice.  Fights right now are pretty much either sniping, or cqb.

 

The mod saw a lot more use out of ironsights and medium range engagements imo, but part of that is due to being able to zoom in more by default.  It wasn't very difficult to shoot 300m shots in the mod with some practice using ironsights, in the SA it's hard to even see anything at that distance with the reduced amount of zoom.

 

They added zoom with iron sights recently so thats a good start.

[Bororm 1156]

They added zoom with iron sights recently so thats a good start.

 

Unless you're talking about something on experimental that I haven't seen yet, what they did was actually default the view to be further out a while back, giving better situational awareness which is nice, but with the "zoom" taking you back to what it was before that and not actually being increased.

 

It's still significantly less than the mod/arma2 zoom.

 

That was months ago though, so I'm not sure if that's what you're referring to.

Edited September 16, 2014 by Bororm

[gibonez 3633]

Unless you're talking about something on experimental that I haven't seen yet, what they did was actually default the view to be further out a while back.  With the "zoom" taking you back to what it was before that.

 

It's still significantly less than the mod/arma2 zoom.

 

If that is the case than thats awful.

 

Iron sights should allow for medium range shooting and sadly with the way the game is currently set up only optics are viable for anything past 200m.

[hombrecz 832]

Lol, i am fully aware of how things are now, I live in eastern Germany and I visit CZ like once a month to go shopping some stuff ( yeah, i'm one of those tourists :P ) The point where i needed your knowledge was when i said "there never was cyrillic alphabet in CZ in "the past" like, for example, before WW2. :) )

 

Anyway, thanks for the reply. If I will once meet you in Petrovice, i will do the Q and E dance to show that i am friendly.

 

I did not know you lived in Germany man :-).  Ok we can have friendly dance in Petrovice, no problem with that :-D.

 

There was crazy type of alphabet called "Hlaholice", that Cyril and Metodej who came from Greece, brought here  (it looked like crap tbh, just google it).

And according to googlle, after like 10th century, there was switch to Latin and Cyrillic, so apparently there was a time, when Cyrilic was used around here (did not know that).

Still it must have been pretty darn long time ago, since Cyrillic was used as official language in these lands.

[q.S Sachiel 470]

I did not know you lived in Germany man :-).  Ok we can have friendly dance in Petrovice, no problem with that :-D.

 

There was crazy type of alphabet called "Hlaholice", that Cyril and Metodej who came from Greece, brought here  (it looked like crap tbh, just google it).

And according to googlle, after like 10th century, there was switch to Latin and Cyrillic, so apparently there was a time, when Cyrilic was used around here (did not know that).

Still it must have been pretty darn long time ago, since Cyrillic was used as official language in these lands.

LOL crop circles!!

Czech Republic/-oslovakia:

Because aliens.

 

On topic: anyone mind explaining the use of explosive launchers on infantry, ala ARMA3 titan launcher with the AP round (i thought this was armor-piercing, turns out anti-personell)

Don't see the advantage of using a single explosive on persons unless the aim is to punch through a wall and throw shrapnel about. 

I played a lot of quake as a kid (quakeSchool for life) and would probably just be shooting at their feet or at my own to try to get a bit of air, but don't see firing at the ground as being particularly effective in real life, save for spitting up frags and rocks and what not into their shins and beyond... It's gotta be for light armored / civilian vehicles or soft cover penetration right?

 

anyone want that VOG-9/m203/RPG/pzShreck/faust/russian equiv going down in dayz?  didn't think so :(

Edited September 16, 2014 by q.S Sachiel

[hombrecz 832]

LOL crop circles!!

Czech Republic/-oslovakia:

Because aliens.

 

True, it looks like some alien mumbo jumbo.

I guess that smurf hair "scientist" would really see that another proof of ancient f*cking aliens :-D.

[Chaingunfighter 917]

Yea a zero attachment ar would be fantastic doubles the utility of the magazines while adding a lower tier ar into the game.

 

Perfect one for that is the m16a2.

 

 

 

High accuracy, low recoil, extremely flat shooting , high muzzle velocity.

 

Accepts bayonet, any m4 magazines, only downside is having to rely on iron sights.

That's why the M16A4 would be inherently better, you'd still have to rely on ironsights, but spend enough time and you can also get basically every M4 attachment (it would need its own handguards, though).

You'd still be forced to use ironsights most of the time, though, because optics and other parts would be especially rare.

 

They could possibly divide the line between "good/modern" AR-15s with "not as good/older" AR-15s, so you could have more common but less modular variants and less common but more modular ones.

 

 

Full-length AR-15s:

[Old] M16/XM16E1/M16A1

[New] M16A4

 

Mid-length AR-15s:

[Old] XM177E2/CAR-15E2

[New] M4A1

CAR-length AR-15s:

[Old] Colt M733

[New] CQB-R/MK18

OR Colt M933

 

 

Pretty easily distinguishable, and you've got a fine line between modularity.

Plus, it's fairly realistic, because a lot of old CAR-15s and M16s went off to Eastern Europe and the Middle East once the M16A2 and eventually M16A4/M4A1 models began replacing the older ones. You could justify the newer M4A1, M16A4, and MK18/M933 as NATO/US weapons, and the M16, XM-177E2, and M733 as Chernarussian surplus/special operations weapons

Edited September 16, 2014 by Chaingunfighter

[gibonez 3633]

The m16a4 is entirely too modular and nothing aside from a 3 round burst would set it apart from the m4.

 

This is why the m16a2 would be optimal as a low end full sized 5.56 military drop.

[-Gews- 7443]

It's still significantly less than the mod/arma2 zoom.

 

Correct, and when the "iron sight zoom" was introduced in 0.44 (?) the magnification was also further reduced about 7% from before, it's currently only 2/3 of ArmA2's zoom.

[agouti 105]

These bad boys are pretty common and seem to work ok, a must for any carry handle ar.

 

 

Note: the pic is just for show, it's not the same make/model I'd use if my life depended on it.

There are better mount/scope setups in this style than this particular one shown that look very very very similar, but it doesn't seem loss of zero and optic clarity are an issue on dayz, and I didn't feel like wanting to link to a separate mount and scope. So take this as proof of concept.

 

Edit before posting: Note I found out the original also came as a one piece unit like the one shown here and is of good quality, unlike the one here.

 

 

[Katana67 2907]

Hey, AUG in the new devblog!

[Deathlove 2280]

We will be getting our first Bullpup gun soon! 83

[gibonez 3633]

Yea hopefully it is the A1.

 

[Chaingunfighter 917]

Yea hopefully it is the A1.

 

And while were at it, give us that Glock 17 :P (or Glock 26, or even a .380 Glock 24)

 

 

Seems after a good drought we're finally getting more weapons (Though I shouldn't be this excited, because they have far more important things to do than add guns), and they're all very significant, unlike anything we have yet - a Rossi R92 lever-action, an MP-133 pump-action shotgun, an SVD sniper rifle, a Steyr AUG bullpup AR, a derringer, and even the AKS-74U is significant because it marks the addition of 5.45x39mm.

Edited September 17, 2014 by Chaingunfighter

[gibonez 3633]

I can't imagine a glock not being in the game eventually.

[Bororm 1156]

I wonder how long till they add a drum mag for the aug  <_<

 

 

(is that the right face? i'm going for sarcastic/annoyed because it'll probably happen and fuck drum mags =P)

Edited September 17, 2014 by Bororm

[gibonez 3633]

I wonder how long till they add a drum mag for the aug  <_<

 

 

(is that the right face? i'm going for sarcastic/annoyed because it'll probably happen and fuck drum mags =P)

 

Let's hope not.

 

I am not even sure why the akm got a drum mag or the pso scope to be honest.

 

It would have been better to just add a rpk74 or another lmg and give it a drum mag instead.

[Katana67 2907]

I don't really get all the hate for drum magazines.

 

As long as they're rare, I don't really have an issue. Both from a gameplay perspective and the broader, "supplying LMGs" perspective. When you think about it, HBAR assault rifles aren't really LMGs. Or they are in name only. Actually, in retrospect, the notion of an IAR actually reflects more accurately what things like the AUG HBAR and RPK are.

 

I think having a belt-fed LMG is far more important/critical than placing importance on what amount to be assault rifles using larger mags.

Edited September 17, 2014 by Katana67

[chompster 171]

Yea hopefully it is the A1.

I really hope so too, but doubt it.

 

For sake of making it modular they'll most likely go with the A3.

Edited September 17, 2014 by Chompster

[gibonez 3633]

I really hope so too, but doubt it.

 

For sake of making it modular they'll most likely go with the A3.

 

Sadly this.

 

Gun dressup seems to be important to them atm.

Edited September 17, 2014 by gibonez

[Chaingunfighter 917]

Sadly this.

 

Gun dressup seems to be important to them atm.

Meh, but the AUG would be a decent tier weapon anyway, it's not like it's some low-end civilian hunting rifle, so the fact that it MIGHT be modular isn't very problematic.

 

However, I wouldn't be SO down, it's very possible they'll choose the A1 because of the built-in scope, which may make for more interesting gameplay.

We'll just have to wait and see.

Edited September 17, 2014 by Chaingunfighter

[Katana67 2907]

Meh, but the AUG would be a decent tier weapon anyway, it's not like it's some low-end civilian hunting rifle, so the fact that it MIGHT be modular isn't very problematic.

 

However, I wouldn't be SO down, it's very possible they'll choose the A1 because of the built-in scope, which may make for more interesting gameplay.

We'll just have to wait and see.

 

Agreed. I think it's a huge cheap shot to indict the developers for following a non-existent "trend" of having everything be hyper-modular.

 

The attachment system is relatively under-utilized in my opinion. It needs to be made more robust, not marginalized (especially in areas which it is commonplace... like with assault rifles).

 

I could go either way with the AUG. I'd like it if it were some kind of railed F88 or AUG variant. But I also wouldn't mind an integrated optic (though it is problematic given the current degradation models [or lack thereof] we've got now). Plus, I prefer the "puzzle" aspect that is created by the attachment system. So, I guess I might slightly favor making it relatively modular.

 

Personally, if we're looking at bullpups... I'd rather some kind of AK bullpup be the "not modular" one, for what it's worth. But then again, I don't see modularity as innately bad on any weapon.

Edited September 19, 2014 by Katana67

[Chaingunfighter 917]

Agreed. I think it's a huge cheap shot to indict the developers for following a non-existent "trend" of having everything be hyper-modular.

 

The attachment system is relatively under-utilized in my opinion. It needs to be made more robust, not marginalized (especially in areas which it is commonplace... like with assault rifles).

 

I could go either way with the AUG. I'd like it if it were some kind of railed F88 or AUG variant. But I also wouldn't mind an integrated optic (though it is problematic given the current degradation models [or lack thereof] we've got now). Plus, I prefer the "puzzle" aspect that is created by the attachment system. So, I guess I might slightly favor making it relatively modular.

 

Personally, if we're looking at bullpups... I'd rather some kind of AK bullpup be the "not modular" one, for what it's worth. But then again, I don't see modularity as innately bad on any weapon.

Yeah, it's definitely a hard line to look at.

 

I'm for most weapons having a large range of modularity, simply because it can be balanced out by the fact that you can use rarity to define how common guns are. So you could still have most Mosins using ironsights, but that doesn't mean it'd be impossible to find PU Scopes (and that's a poor example because the PU Scope is not some ultra uncommon modification, and the Mosin ingame also has more characteristics of the sniper variant than regular one.)

I definitely don't want to take it to the point that gibonez argues, suggesting that a full-length MP5, specifically MP5A2, should have little-to-no modularity (see reddit), but there are some interesting instances in which lack of modularity might make it better (I'm not sure why, exactly, he loves bare-bones guns so much, but nevertheless.) The AUG is just one of those points where you have a chance to balance a lack of modularity with the fact that it already comes better off than most other ARs, but in turn has little else you can do with it. If there weren't so many other bullpup 5.56x45mm ARs I'd say the AUG A3 would be the better choice, but there are alternatives like the F2000 (also has a unique scope) & TAR-21 that don't necessarily have the same opportunities. The biggest point of that is that the F2000 & TAR-21 use STANAG magazines while the AUG (typically) does not (and even with proper modifications isn't universal), so you have to make the choice.

 

Not that it really bothers me, I'm just glad that we're getting a bullpup AR, and the AUG series in general is one of my favorites, so I'd be satisfied with either one. (I'd honestly use the AUG A3 more, I just think the AUG with it's own magazines and still relatively lower modification would lead to it generally being outdone by the M4A1, even if reloading the AUG is quicker.)

[gibonez 3633]

My only hesitation to full blown modularity is due to the adverse effects it will have on gameplay.

 

Mass modularity for the sake of modularity only serves to blend the roles of the guns in the game further something that is bad for gameplay.

 

Take the AKM and the M4 for instance due to drum mags being in the game for these two guns there is pretty much zero reason to include an rpk74 or any lmg or gpmg aside from pure aesthetics.

 

Sure you might argue that later on weapon accessories will be made rarer the instances of fully kitted out m4s and akms will be severely diminished but we all know nothing is ever, ever rare in dayz and people will find a way to loot farm, or dupe or whatever other trickery they do to make these weapons abundant.

 

Limited modularity on 90 percent of the weapons is a huge benefit for gameplay as it would open up opportunities for including unique set of weapons in the game valued not only for their aesthetics but also because of the specific role they might play. The AUG a1 is one such weapon. It might be sought after not because it is a bullpup but because of the unique scope that it comes equipped with.

 

The sig 550 might be another such example sought after because of the built in Bipod with the negatives of not being able to readily take any of the rail mounted optics.

 

This approach to the weapons would on the other hand also put a much higher value on the extremely modular weapons like the m4 and make them highly sought after as they should. If the game treats the weapons with realism in mind when it comes to their handling , accuracy and damage values the only tangible value that puts one weapon ahead of another is how modular it is.

 

Modularity should be king in Stand Alone but only on a select few weapons the majority of the weapons should all fit into niches.

[Chaingunfighter 917]

My only hesitation to full blown modularity is due to the adverse effects it will have on gameplay.

 

Mass modularity for the sake of modularity only serves to blend the roles of the guns in the game further something that is bad for gameplay.

 

Take the AKM and the M4 for instance due to drum mags being in the game for these two guns there is pretty much zero reason to include an rpk74 or any lmg or gpmg aside from pure aesthetics.

 

Sure you might argue that later on weapon accessories will be made rarer the instances of fully kitted out m4s and akms will be severely diminished but we all know nothing is ever, ever rare in dayz and people will find a way to loot farm, or dupe or whatever other trickery they do to make these weapons abundant.

 

Limited modularity on 90 percent of the weapons is a huge benefit for gameplay as it would open up opportunities for including unique set of weapons in the game valued not only for their aesthetics but also because of the specific role they might play. The AUG a1 is one such weapon. It might be sought after not because it is a bullpup but because of the unique scope that it comes equipped with.

 

The sig 550 might be another such example sought after because of the built in Bipod with the negatives of not being able to readily take any of the rail mounted optics.

 

This approach to the weapons would on the other hand also put a much higher value on the extremely modular weapons like the m4 and make them highly sought after as they should. If the game treats the weapons with realism in mind when it comes to their handling , accuracy and damage values the only tangible value that puts one weapon ahead of another is how modular it is.

 

Modularity should be king in Stand Alone but only on a select few weapons the majority of the weapons should all fit into niches.

 

Having M4A1s with drum mags would not reduce the point of having a 5.56x45mm LMG like an M249, because 100/200 round M249 mags don't work with the M4A1. Now, they do plan on adding a drum mag for the M4A1, probably a 100Rnd Beta C-Mag, but that's still half the default M249 carrying capacity, and add that to the fact that the M249 can also use STANAG magazines, it's a much better support weapon.

 

Likewise, RPK & RPK-74 drum mags are compatible with the regular AK & AK-74, so they'd be in the game regardless. To say that there's no point in using an RPK would be fallacious, considering that they have a built-in bipod, are more stable recoil wise (because of the heavy barrel), and are more accurate, at the cost of a slower turn rate & increased weight. That's why RPKs are still used in real life instead of just equipping regular AKs with drum mags.

 

Even with both of them, having GPMGs still serves a huge purpose, because the AKM and M4A1 do not fire a full-sized rifle cartridge. The PKM, MG3, M240, M60, and whatever else are nothing like an AKM with a 75 round drum. The suppression and support effect of having a full cartridge (7.62x51mm or 7.62x54mmR) would far outclass simply spraying an AR with significantly less range and accuracy. That, and drum mags aren't typical for ARs, whereas you'll practically always see MGs using higher capacity magazines, so they could just alleviate the problem by making specific AR drum mags rare. If they want an RPK they obviously can't make AK drums hyper rare, but they'll still be relatively hard to find considering the LMG in itself is still a huge advantage.

 

I'm in agreement with you about the AUG, but not in general about modularity. If you honestly think that nothing can ever be rare, then they shouldn't be including anything like that in the first place. Otherwise, again, it's a fallacious argument, as items that spawn less frequently will appear less frequently, duplicating isn't like hacking and CAN be permanently fixed.

 

So, of course some guns should have factors that set them apart, but that doesn't mean under-utilizing the attachment system, especially with guns that are naturally heavily modular. They don't have to make the SG-55X they may add spawn with common optics, but why exactly is it a problem that you can put an aimpoint on it if you so choose and are lucky enough to find one?

I'm not saying attachments should be readily available, but the potential to make guns better SHOULD be utilized.

 

The line is drawn between guns that are advantageous and fill a specific niche, and general guns that aren't inherently awesome but can be made as such. There needs to be an actual balance of them, not just "90% of the guns should have no attachments."