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bobotype3334

Human versus human/Human versus zombie combat

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Okay so this is a list of ideas for attack capabilities of zombies and players.

SURVIVOR
Fighting abilities:
>Punches
>Tackle from a run, knocking the target flat on their back with the Survivor atop them. If you are on top, you get up faster than the one on the bottom [no innuendo here], leaving you at a tactical advantage. This can also break bones.
>Grab onto weapons an attacker is holding to disarm
>Grapple or hug enemies to try and move them around or throw them down
>Wield melee weapons such as knives/sabers/machetes, golf clubs, pitchforks, fire axes, slegdehammers, fire extinguishers, even biro pens and more at close range
>Shoot rifles, handguns, rocket launchers, crossbows, bows, and throw objects at range
>Weaponise vehicles such as cars, boats, motorbikes, trucks, tanks, buses, helicopters and even bikes/horses to knock over and severely wound or to kill depending on speed
[over 60 km/h to kill instantly, or being involved in a car crash at over 100km/h]
>Can build or lay traps like pits, place explosives, erect barbed wire, cause fires, spread disease, demolish structures on people, tie unconscious up to die, trap and induce starvation, and probably some more stuff

ZOMBIE
Fighting abilities:
>Clawing, can spread disease and induce bleeding on unclothed targets, severely damage clothing and
>Haymaker, zombie flails its arms really hard with disregard for own pain, can break bones, cause internal bleeding, rarely knock unconscious if hits the head.
>Biting, this will always make bleeding, sometimes spread disease and damage clothing, zombie will attempt it if close enough
>Tackle, zombie will jump at their target from a run and knock them on their back with the zombie on top of them. Can break bones, and the zombie will also try to bite you if it succeeds in tackling.
>If zombies are carrying explosives [military zombie] very rarely they will blow up when caught in a fire or explosion, which can damage people or zombies nearby
>Zombies are a hotbed of disease, even their corpses or loot from their corpses can still kill you via giving you dysentery for example

MELEE WEAPON FUNCTIONALITY
>Chainsaws are fast and powerful, cutting right through limbs on swing, but jam in clothing and need fuel.
>Heavy sharp melee weapons, such as fire axes, are the most powerful but can become caught in ribcages, leaving you in severe trouble in the middle of a mob of zombies. Since they get stuck in their target, they have no knockback to help you distance from your target. Swing speed is slow, inventory space needed big.
>Heavy blunt melee weapons, e.g. sledgehammers and shovels, are half as powerful, but let you knock people unconscious and have no risk of becoming stuck. They also knock back targets from you. They swing slow and are high-encumbrance [don't fit in most packs]
>Sharp medium melees, such as machetes, have less damage. They can stab for higher damage but higher stick chance, or can slash for less damage, more speed and less stick chance. High speed, a bit of encumbrance; can be carried in a belt at your side.
>Blunt medium melees, such as baseball bats, work similarly to sharp medium melees but with no sticking or stabbing. Good for knocking unconscious, swings fast and is lighter.
>Small sharp melees, such as knives/sickles, do the least damage, and need to be really close, but still inflict bleeding and don't stick. They can stab or slash. Can be put in gun holster for rapid access.
>Ranged sharp melees, such as pitchforks or hoes or affixed bayonets, can attack from far away. Have a high sticking chance and are slow, and don't fit in bags [except bayonet], but give you valuable distance from zombies.
>Fire extinguishers grant the best knockback, but low damage, low swing speed, and are heavy.

 

Edited by bobotype3334

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Holy hell, didn't realise this post was so big
For a tl;dr the main differences between humans and zombies are that zeds generally take 1 or 2 extra shots to kill every time, and can't use weapons.
Melee weapons all have different upsides and downsides, the bigger they are the more damage they do but become harder to carry or equip, while sharp weapons cause more damage and bleeding but can get stuck in the wound, leaving you vulnerable, while blunt weapons are weaker but knock away enemies and can knock Survivors unconscious.

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WHAT are you talking about??

Read it bro.

I'll edit it for consistency

MELEE WEAPON TYPES

>Heavy Sharp: Fire Axes, splitter axes, pickaxes,

>Heavy Blunt: Shovels, sledgehammers, firewood,

>Medium Sharp: Machetes, sabers, sickles

>Medium Blunt: Baseball bats, hammers, Crowbars, pipe wrenches

>Small Sharp: Combat knives, kitchen knives, screwdrivers, unaffixed bayonets

>Ranged Sharp: Hoes, fixed bayonets, pitchforks

>Fire Extinguishers

>Biro pens [counts as small sharp, but one use only]

>Rifle butt/pistol whip [counts as medium blunt, it's an alt-fire of rifles]

Edited by bobotype3334

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I would like zombies and survivors taking the same damage from attacks with zombies not getting knocked out though (making them technically "more resistant" as they won't stop fighting). Specific damage should depend on the weapon in question. Gunshot does not equal gunshot (though for military rifles the difference might be more about penetrating obstacles/armor).

 

Zombies are flithy and should carry risk of disease.

 

Sticking is a pretty decent concept but I am not sure if there is a way to implement it in a satisfying way. Maybe simply increasing the time between strikes if you hit a (soft) target would do it.

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Read it bro.

I'll edit it for consistency

MELEE WEAPON TYPES

>Heavy Sharp: Fire Axes, splitter axes, pickaxes,

>Heavy Blunt: Shovels, sledgehammers, firewood,

>Medium Sharp: Machetes, sabers, sickles

>Medium Blunt: Baseball bats, hammers, Crowbars, pipe wrenches

>Small Sharp: Combat knives, kitchen knives, screwdrivers, unaffixed bayonets

>Ranged Sharp: Hoes, fixed bayonets, pitchforks

>Fire Extinguishers

>Biro pens [counts as small sharp, but one use only]

>Rifle butt/pistol whip [counts as medium blunt, it's an alt-fire of rifles]

 

So ... This is what it currently takes in the game or is it you making up stuff? Why do you assume making a list of things is enough for people to understand what you're on about?

 

Why do you use the word "logistics"? This has nothing to do with logistics ... ?

Edited by King Raptor

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So ... This is what it currently takes in the game or is it you making up stuff? Why do you assume making a list of things is enough for people to understand what you're on about?

 

Why do you use the word "logistics"? This has nothing to do with logistics ... ?

Did you realise that he posted it in the "suggestion" section?

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Did you realise that he posted it in the "suggestion" section?

Nope! Did not realise. Also, did not gather from the opening line as it said " a lowdown" which to me was weird-speak for "summary".

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I would like zombies and survivors taking the same damage from attacks with zombies not getting knocked out though (making them technically "more resistant" as they won't stop fighting). Specific damage should depend on the weapon in question. Gunshot does not equal gunshot (though for military rifles the difference might be more about penetrating obstacles/armor).

 

Zombies are flithy and should carry risk of disease.

 

Sticking is a pretty decent concept but I am not sure if there is a way to implement it in a satisfying way. Maybe simply increasing the time between strikes if you hit a (soft) target would do it.

Yes, I thought zombies shouldn't be prone to knockout too. Maybe the virus just keeps their motor centres going because technically as zombies they already aren't technically in normal waking consciousness?

I know gunshot doesn't equal gunshot realistically, but the differences are minimal enough that we can just discern "bullet" or "high powered bullet" categories, right? Unless you have a separate strength category for '22s and stuff.

Sticking is just an idea because fire axes, as melees, are objectively the best melee choice at the moment. So having all that power, but having to worry about whether it's going to have a 1/4 chance of lodging in the wound, comes into consideration and makes other melee weapons a more viable choice, and it increases realism.

 

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For the existing cartridges its roughly .22LR < .380 ACP < 9mm < .45 APC < .375 Magnum < 5.56mm < 7.62x39mm < 7.62x54mmR and then there should be a significant difference between rifles and handguns with the latter being significantly weaker because of their barrel length (which should also translate into minor damage differences between rifles of the same caliber like AK-101/M4A1).

 

In fact the weaker guns (e.g. Makarow) would need quite a few shots while even larger caliber rifles usually require more than one. So it would be something like about 1 to 5 shots to the head and about 1 to ~10 shots to the body depending on weapon. So instead of calculating damage based on category I propose calculating damage independently for each weapon. I also think your melee weapon damage is a little overbuffed compared to the firearms. A Fireaxe should not instantly kill someone with a body hit - its already annoying that you can do this to zombies right now.

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SURVIVOR

To kill:

>2 high powered bullets to the body

 

I stopped reading here because of how ridiculous this statement is.  "I'm cool guys, I only took 1 bullet to the chest."  I could go on a 2 page rant about this, but I'm sick and don't feel like it today.

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I'm still looking for the original poster's suggestion.  Right now, it's just a list of some things that are only partially relevant.

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I stopped reading here because of how ridiculous this statement is.  "I'm cool guys, I only took 1 bullet to the chest."  I could go on a 2 page rant about this, but I'm sick and don't feel like it today.

I did my research, I'm talking to kill fully, not just to seriously injure. I'm not saying anyone's going to be "cool" after taking a high powered rifle bullet to the body, I'm just saying you can survive it to bandage yourself up, but that 2 bullets is too much and the survivor just dies. We could count the heart as a "headshot" area too, because obviously a rifle bullet to the heart is going to kill you pretty fast, but being shot twice in the kidney or whatever is survivable.

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For the existing cartridges its roughly .22LR < .380 ACP < 9mm < .45 APC < .375 Magnum < 5.56mm < 7.62x39mm < 7.62x54mmR and then there should be a significant difference between rifles and handguns with the latter being significantly weaker because of their barrel length (which should also translate into minor damage differences between rifles of the same caliber like AK-101/M4A1).

 

In fact the weaker guns (e.g. Makarow) would need quite a few shots while even larger caliber rifles usually require more than one. So it would be something like about 1 to 5 shots to the head and about 1 to ~10 shots to the body depending on weapon. So instead of calculating damage based on category I propose calculating damage independently for each weapon. I also think your melee weapon damage is a little overbuffed compared to the firearms. A Fireaxe should not instantly kill someone with a body hit - its already annoying that you can do this to zombies right now.

I'm sort of iffy about it taking 5 Makarov headshots to kill someone, and so would a lot of people. People are getting pissed off enough about the damage thing so I took it out. Doesn't a bullet bouncing in the brain do more damage than one that penetrates straight through, anyway? So headshot damage should roughly equal out there. With my suggestions of zombies being able to tackle, melee damage isn't too overbuffed. Imagine a mob of zombies all running at you, some able to tackle, all highly likely to rip up your clothes and draw blood/break your bones/infect you with diseases rapidly, and you're expected to nail up to 5 consecutive headshots on each one with your pistol.

Fireaxes do that damage right now and it is really too damn good, which is why I proposed sticking, as a mild annoyance but which one which reduces effectiveness of the fire axe and other melees. And thus all melees have advantages and disadvantages just like in IRL, while also having their tool-uses.

And "body hit" does not include arms and legs, either, by the way.

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I did my research, I'm talking to kill fully, not just to seriously injure. I'm not saying anyone's going to be "cool" after taking a high powered rifle bullet to the body, I'm just saying you can survive it to bandage yourself up, but that 2 bullets is too much and the survivor just dies. We could count the heart as a "headshot" area too, because obviously a rifle bullet to the heart is going to kill you pretty fast, but being shot twice in the kidney or whatever is survivable.

Regardless of how long it will take you to die, you will do it on the ground in excruciating pain.  Body shots drop targets.  The problem I have is that the game lets you keep running around and doing whatever you like while you've got two bullets in your kidney.  Ever been punched in the kidney?  I'm sure getting shot there is much less painful....

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Regardless of how long it will take you to die, you will do it on the ground in excruciating pain.  Body shots drop targets.  The problem I have is that the game lets you keep running around and doing whatever you like while you've got two bullets in your kidney.  Ever been punched in the kidney?  I'm sure getting shot there is much less painful....

Well obviously you'd fall to the ground and go into shock and such; this is DayZ, remember? I'm just saying one [1] won't kill you directly. And that's where getting a shot of morphine or adrenalin or other such deus ex machina gameplay concessions come in.

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