Realistic player identification

[scriptfactory 620]

I was on the train today listening to the audiobook of World War Z and I realized why people haven't started self-regulating and building communities like in the book. It is impossible to identify other players.
 

The business of elections really set the tone for his entire administra­tion. So many of his proposals looked crazy at first glance, but once you peeled back the first layer, you realized that underneath there existed a core of irrefutable logic.

Take the new punishment laws, those really set me off. Putting people in stocks? Whipping them in town squares! ?! What was this, Old Salem, the Taliban's Afghanistan? It sounded barbaric, un-American, until you really thought about the options. What were you going to do with thieves and looters, put them in prison? Who would that help? Who could afford to divert able-bodied citizens to feed, clothe, and guard other able-bodied citizens? More importantly, why remove the punished from society when they could serve as such a valuable deterrent? Yes, there was the fear of pain-the lash, the cane-but all of that paled when compared to public humiliation. People were terrified of having their crimes exposed.

At a time when everyone was pulling together, helping each other out, working to protect and take care of one another, the worst thing you could do to someone was to march them up into the public square with a giant poster reading "I Stole My Neighbor's Firewood." Shame's a power­ful weapon, but it depended on everyone else doing the right thing. No one is above the law, and seeing a senator given fifteen lashes for his in­volvement in war profiteering did more to curb crime than a cop on every street corner. Yes, there were the work gangs, but those were the recidivists, those who'd been given chances time and time again. I remember the at­torney general suggesting that we dump as many of them into the infested zones as possible, rid ourselves of the drain and potential hazard of their continued presence. Both the president and I opposed diis proposition; my objections were ethical, his were practical. We were still talking about Amer­ican soil, infested yes, but, hopefully one day to be liberated.


"The last thing we needed," he said "was to come up against one of these ex-cons as The New Grand Warlord of Duluth."

I thought he was joking, but later, as I saw the exact thing happen in other countries, as some exiled criminals rose to command their own isolated, and in some cases, powerful fiefdoms, I real­ized we'd dodged one hell of a speeding bullet. The work gangs were always an issue for us, politically, socially, even economically, but what other choice did we have for those who just refused to play nice with others?

 

If we were able to actually recognize other players the KoS issue would start to self-regulate. You would see Douchebag McDoucherson randomly killing noobs. You would tell your friends to stay away from this guy. Don't trust him. Eventually communities would form around players that trust each other and are friendly. Bounty hunters would show up to take care of the douchebags.

Right now I can just run into a group of randoms and, if I have the same gear and skin color as everyone else, they will think I am a member of said group. That is totally unrealistic. In real life I remember everyone's face and voice. I also remember if they are a douchebag or not. Conversely, you never know if someone you just met is someone you have encountered in the past since we all look the same.

In my opinion individual player identification is just as necessary as faction/group identification. Perhaps moreso. If there is a KoSer running around fucking with people we should be able to make bounties for him. We should be able to alert the community that this guy is not friendly. Once people are able to paint these guys with a scarlet letter they will calm down or be rejected from communities.

"Name tags" and unchangeable usernames are the easiest way to solve this but I guess many players will be against it. Is there really any way that the devs could pull this off without sacrificing too much immersion? Does any game allow you to identify players based purely on their appearance?

Could this be handled with a tool? Say a notebook on which you "draw" the face of the dude you killed and share these drawings with others. You could later hold the notebook up next to the face of someone before letting him into a secure area. If his face isn't included in your notebook he is good. Otherwise, kill that fool. It could also be used to verify targets for bounties.

This really isn't a suggestion. I just wanted to know what others thought about this.

[So Sexy 259]

The problem is - who would build such communities? Too much work and coordination.There are always people who would screw everything up. Everything is okay for me, in real life, you cant really tell if the other person is friendly or not, okay the look on his face, his stance, but these are things that would be nearly impossible to implement, and even if done, I find it hard to believe, that it would always work properly or work at all. And the bandit/hero skin stuff has been discussed numerous times - that system was abused, and will be abused.And about the looks eg the drawing in the notebook, or system with player names etc, both can be changed with a few clicks.

Edited May 18, 2014 by So Sexy

[UltimateGentleman 355]

I don't think there's really an in-game solution for this, however an out of game solution could be someone setting up a site with a list and pictures of known murderers.

 

You're never really going to be playing with the same group of people long enough to get to know all of them though even if you stay on the same server all the time it won't always be the same other 39 people who play.

 

I don't think there's any viable solution that could work since so many people play the game and there are so many servers but when there actually is some character customization it could possibly work to an extent.

 

 

Maybe some guy will have an X painted on his clothes all the time or will always have an orange helmet so you could see them and be like oh my god it's that guy!

Or maybe you could have identifiable facial features like player placed scars so someone with one gets a name for themselves amongst the community as "Scarface"

 

 

The problem is that you're never really going to see peoples faces much, I mean who in game just lets you examine them? Maybe if when you were holding someone up they could make it so that you could take their helmets and masks off and look at their face.

Would be cool if clans could put facepaint on with like a Z or something so they know the person they meet is in the Z clan, things like that.

 

No system would ever be perfect though sadly.

[massacrorBKK 64]

It could be nice indeed as recognize people in the game is very harder than in real (especially because everybody got the same face and gear while in real life you would have some small but significant details).

 

On another I think that this feature would work when you are near enough of the person (and you can see those details).

 

No bounty hunter sniper killing you from a mile and knowing without doubt that you were the guy he was after...

 

For sure you can't know every bandit in there, but it is just like in the wild west, you can't know all the bad guys and that's why you keep suspicious, but maybe one day come where you may meet one motherfucker you remember his name and it will make the difference.

Edited May 18, 2014 by massacrorBKK

[Gdaddy22 299]

I like this idea

[Bearserk 57]

Before any of this could work we need private hives.

[applejaxc 2500]

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

 

wait, you think KoS will actually try to regulate itself?

 

No. It won't. Keep dreaming.

Edited May 18, 2014 by Applejaxc

[MagneticToast 102]

We just need better character customization. I know it is alpha of course...but I'm talking in general. In real life you can recognize someone by their body type, posture, mannerisms. In games that's not possible so you just rely on a face with the same animations as everyone else. Would be cool if there were a few animation sets you could choose from.

[scriptfactory 620]

We just need better character customization. I know it is alpha of course...but I'm talking in general. In real life you can recognize someone by their body type, posture, mannerisms. In games that's not possible so you just rely on a face with the same animations as everyone else. Would be cool if there were a few animation sets you could choose from.

 

DayZ character customization will never approach real life. Not even close. Even in MMOs with extreme levels of customization it is difficult to recognize your friends simply based on their character model. Have you heard of Black Desert? My company was sourcing it for a European release and it has the most impressive character customization I have ever seen. Even with its advanced character creation options it could be difficult to identify friends without name tags. DayZ will never get anything that approaches Black Desert.

So, in my opinion, better customization will not solve the problem.

[scriptfactory 620]

wait, you think KoS will actually try to regulate itself?

 

No. I like the KoS element in DayZ. It really brings excitement. That doesn't mean that players shouldn't have tools available to recognize or combat KoSers and griefers. As of now players feel helpless in this situation and there is no possibility of forming in-game communities or cultures due to lack of ability to trust and recognize others.

[Irish. 4886]

This really isn't a suggestion. I just wanted to know what others thought about this.

 

The mod.

 

It has sidechat where you can talk to other players, on a global level. You can warn others of a danger zone, clan, etc.. Also there is bandit, hero, and survivor skins. Anyone that kills to many players, has their humanity level drop.. and this puts a highly recognizable bandit skin on them. Its not flawless in the mod, as they are metagame ways of cheating around it. But its a start. I think they should have something.. like blood on the players clothing, regardless of what they are wearing, if they have killed others. Same with gear. If picked off of a dead player, it should be bloody. A hero, after saving several players medically, should get a small red cross armband, or similar. And a new spawn would have none of those. But then again, having it be a complete mystery sort of adds to the SA. You could fool others by putting on UN helmets, etc.. or hiding your weapons in your clothes, pack.

 

I like the way it is here in the SA.. as you dont have the ability to just judge a book by its cover anymore. Now you have to watch and learn.. or shoot without no regard. 

Edited May 18, 2014 by lrish

[qww 287]

im so against the bandit and hero thing., while i would love to see true player identification in some way, but the only way it could happen is by everyone having a different face (i think?), and i dont expect we will see that .

i woudlnt wana see any name tags on screen or anything 

[ld-airgrafix 403]

Honestly i dont mind ISS system, they show you who is a bandit in player list, then display the name above the player. Ok its unrealistic but so are zombies so who cares. Maybe display the name when players are really close to each other

[Pandema 352]

Honestly i dont mind ISS system, they show you who is a bandit in player list, then display the name above the player. Ok its unrealistic but so are zombies so who cares. Maybe display the name when players are really close to each other

 

 

 

First off, uuuurggghhhh this suggestion again.

Secondly, its IFF Identification Friend or Foe. Not ISS, International Space Station.

[ld-airgrafix 403]

First off, uuuurggghhhh this suggestion again.

Secondly, its IFF Identification Friend or Foe. Not ISS, International Space Station.

ISS stands for Infestation survivor stories.

[FrostDMG 398]

I guess you didn't play the mod when Bandit skin was in the game - kill innocent players and you become a bandit, pretty much "KoS me please" target on your face.

What did this cause?

Bandits had to KoS or get KoSd even if they didn't want to.

You could become a bandit even if you kill in self defence.

Conclusion: Tried and tested- this doesn't work.

[scriptfactory 620]

I guess you didn't play the mod when Bandit skin was in the game - kill innocent players and you become a bandit, pretty much "KoS me please" target on your face.

What did this cause?

Bandits had to KoS or get KoSd even if they didn't want to.

You could become a bandit even if you kill in self defence.

Conclusion: Tried and tested- this doesn't work.

 

I actually wasn't talking about people getting automatically labeled as a bandit. I was thinking the community should be able to pass around "lists" of guys they don't want participating in their community. This would be a virtual list, of course, and should be able to be transferred to other players, perhaps outside of the game via an import/export feature. Each player entry would also have to be linked to a player's unique id for this to work, of course. After using the item in-game you could get a message like "This player is wanted on server XXX for [insert crime here]" or "Don't believe his lies".

Yes, I was thinking a Polaroid camera would be the item that captures the image and there would be a way to "copy" Polaroids to other people. Take a Polaroid when the dude is dead and write "He attacked our town". Take a Polaroid after capturing an asshole that was shooting noobs and write on the label "This guy kills babies".

Edited May 19, 2014 by scriptfactory

[Karmaterror 982]

I like the idea, would be easy to counter it with a change of cloths and a mask or something, but at least if caught and photographed the bandit now has to change his appearance and that's just more immersion.

 

Trying to think of a way we could have them uploaded to people. Maybe if we did have a PDA item or something, the police stations could have a server in them. Plug in your pda and get that servers list downloaded into it. Or with a digital camera take the shot, upload to your pda then update the server with a new record.

 

Also allows for fake reports to be uploaded by bandits lol. Imagine a hero group catching you and putting you on trial for your alleged crime :D

 

Maybe 2 photo spots in each report.....identification: a close up of the player.......and a supporting evidence : shot of the crime. Then heros looking for someone to bring to justice can filter fake reports a bit :)

[ZomboWTF 527]

*snip*

 

wait, you think KoS will actually try to regulate itself?

 

No. It won't. Keep dreaming.

Yep,

the only way to regulate KOS is to KOS the KOSers and not KOS the not-KOSers and coastal spawns

that way you might make people think how nice it can be to actually talk to people

 

There was a bandit system in DayZ Mod, and there is a buddy system in wasteland

the only thing these things are used for is to identify enemies faster so you can shoot faster, end of story.

Edited May 19, 2014 by Zombo

[liquidsnake 275]

From afar you shouldn't see the nametag, but when you get close enough (to the point where you would be able to see his face clearly IRL) his name should appear. There should also be an option to hide your name by wearing certain masks. 
This way you can identify friendlies you've met in the past and it should dumb down KoS at least a bit. However, you can now also identify your killers, which is of course a huge con.

[Whyherro123 2283]

I kind of like the idea of a "Reptuation" -like system, maybe player-influenced?

Think about it, how would it happen in real life? 

Bandit gang is known to be operating in an area, and shoots up a caravan, leans on local people for gear and food. People know all around that these are bad dudes, and treat the gang members accordingly. Derision when they aren't around, and deference when they are.

 

It makes sense, is authentic, and could work.

[ZomboWTF 527]

I kind of like the idea of a "Reptuation" -like system, maybe player-influenced?

Think about it, how would it happen in real life? 

Bandit gang is known to be operating in an area, and shoots up a caravan, leans on local people for gear and food. People know all around that these are bad dudes, and treat the gang members accordingly. Derision when they aren't around, and deference when they are.

 

It makes sense, is authentic, and could work.

except bandits in DayZ are nowadays identical with KOSers in the Dayz players mind, in which case all the "locals" which are mostly zombies, would be dead

 

what should the locals tell you anyway?

 

"Yeah, he was a guy, and he had a rifle... and green clothes..."

[Whyherro123 2283]

-snip-

I was referring to an event when Day Z progresses beyond the murder-KOS-filled fuckfest it currently is, and becomes more of a survival/society-rebuilding simulator.

As of right now, the survival scenario (no shelters, only canned food, etc) presented in the Standalone is very "unstable", and wouldn't last more than a couple of weeks in a real-life SHTF-type event.  After that, people would either band together in order to farm food/steal said food, or starve to death. 

I've touched on this topic many times before. Look my responses up to see just how unrealistic current Day Z standalone is.

..

Believe it or not, the Epoch mod is pretty much how it would go down in real life, and something similar to that (without AI traders, them being replaced by actual players) with added agriculture (somehow) would be something I would eventually like to see the standalone becoming.

 

And yes, that is pretty much what I would expect a member of a newly-formed community to say,

"Yeah, last night a bunch of guys came down from the road to the north. They took most of our crops and killed all of our animals, and said they would do it again if we didn't pay up. I think they were from that bandit gang that we heard about from some travelling merchants the other day. If you wipe them out, we will be really grateful, and give you a safe place to sleep/good prices for goods/free food and medical aid/money per bandit head/what have you"

 

Boom. Realism, and a reason/reward for PvP!

Edited May 19, 2014 by Whyherro123

[xalienax 621]

I think if they added an in-depth character creator at the beginning of your life similar to EVE online or Skyrim with thousands of potential variations the odds of any 2 players being "identical" would be slim. this combined with Fortifications, i could see clans, especially RP focused one walling off parts of town and forcing approacing survivors to "reval them selves" before being allowed in. could make for interesting gameplay. main issue i see is the amount of time (diverted from other items/priorities) that would need to be dedicate into creating new, highly detailed player models and the system to create them.

 

Aditionally, while not diminishing more traditonal PvP at all, it would set the tone for a new life on a new character being forced to go thru creating your character each life. that few minutes spent there also pretty much rules out running back to your body and continuing to have a meat grinder style death match within a few blocks, almost like BF3 or CoD style. anyone spening more then a few mins in bero on a populated server knows what i mean about  that.

[DMentMan 707]

is it this book?

because im reading this one.

Edited May 19, 2014 by DMentMan